Hucks Army - Faith. Family. Freedom. [Grassroots] JOIN HUCKS ARMY | GET INVOLVED | FUNDRAISING | LINKS | LEADERSHIP | ABOUT
It is currently Tue Dec 10, 2019 4:32 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 23 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: The Fiscal Cliff
PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:22 am 
Offline
***** General

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:12 pm
Posts: 4153
Likes: 307
Liked: 525
Wendero wrote:
I suppose this thread is as good as any to start talking about the debt ceiling.

I'm thinking of writing a blog post and analyse, as an economist, whether it would be smart for the US to default (I write for caffeinated thoughts). I don't think we're quite at that point yet, but if the choice is between 1) raising the debt ceiling without any significant spending cuts or 2) defaulting... well, then I prefer the second option.

Same thing with the new budget. Though I'm not a fan of government shutdowns so maybe the debt ceiling is a better fight to take (a shutdown won't do much to reduce government debt and will inevitably be blamed on Republicans).


In my opinion, we have an immense long-term problem that will occur if we don't cut spending. But we also have an immense short-term and long-term problem that will occur if we don't raise the debt ceiling. I don't see any benefit in not raising it.

If we don't cut spending, which we absolutely must do, we will soon be facing a $20 trillion dollar national debt - an absurd figure. We have to do something different. On the other hand, if we don't raise the debt ceiling, we will default, our credit raiting will be lowered, the interest rate on our debt will rise and the value of our currency could fall. If this happens, we not only will still have a spending issue that needs to be resolved but we will have an even tougher time fixing that long-term problem as more of the revenue we have will need to go toward paying increased interest and not toward things that we actually do need to fund.

What benefit would there be in not raising the debt ceiling? Also, what specifically would you advocate cutting in terms of spending? What needs to be cut from the budget and how we can attack the deficit?

_________________
The Values Voter
http://thevaluesvoter.spaces.live.com


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Fiscal Cliff
PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:05 pm 
Offline
** General
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:21 pm
Posts: 1288
Location: Washington State
Likes: 0
Liked: 11
I don't think our current political system is capable of eliminating (maybe not even reducing?) the debt. There is no negative feedback loop for running up our debt, so why would we ever stop doing it?

Raising the debt ceiling just shifts the inevitable pain from us to our children & their descendants.

I am sure that Obama & most of congress would say that "we just need a little more money right now, very soon we'll be back on our feet & then we can pay it back". But that does nothing to address the underlying problem, which is that our government and most of our population has no concept of doing anything in a sustainable manner. As my high school Driver's Ed teacher used to say, "you need to look farther down the road". However our short-sighted political system and our ingrained selfishness prevent us from doing that.

I am also worried that the concept of "living within your means" is so foreign to so many people, that not enough people will think it is a goal worth sacrificing for, and they will fight any attempts by elected officials to move toward living within our means.

Thus I foresee a series of very painful lessons in our future, all of which we could have prevented, but we chose not to.

Hopefully we will learn from these lessons, but I am afraid that it may take a couple of generations, and to use a medical analogy, the loss of a few limbs, for the lessons to sink in.
TheValuesVoter wrote:
Wendero wrote:
I suppose this thread is as good as any to start talking about the debt ceiling.

I'm thinking of writing a blog post and analyse, as an economist, whether it would be smart for the US to default (I write for caffeinated thoughts). I don't think we're quite at that point yet, but if the choice is between 1) raising the debt ceiling without any significant spending cuts or 2) defaulting... well, then I prefer the second option.

Same thing with the new budget. Though I'm not a fan of government shutdowns so maybe the debt ceiling is a better fight to take (a shutdown won't do much to reduce government debt and will inevitably be blamed on Republicans).


In my opinion, we have an immense long-term problem that will occur if we don't cut spending. But we also have an immense short-term and long-term problem that will occur if we don't raise the debt ceiling. I don't see any benefit in not raising it.

If we don't cut spending, which we absolutely must do, we will soon be facing a $20 trillion dollar national debt - an absurd figure. We have to do something different. On the other hand, if we don't raise the debt ceiling, we will default, our credit raiting will be lowered, the interest rate on our debt will rise and the value of our currency could fall. If this happens, we not only will still have a spending issue that needs to be resolved but we will have an even tougher time fixing that long-term problem as more of the revenue we have will need to go toward paying increased interest and not toward things that we actually do need to fund.

What benefit would there be in not raising the debt ceiling? Also, what specifically would you advocate cutting in terms of spending? What needs to be cut from the budget and how we can attack the deficit?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Fiscal Cliff
PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 5:10 am 
Offline
** General
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:42 pm
Posts: 1265
Location: McAlester, Ok
Likes: 173
Liked: 107
georgiaguy wrote:
Patriot4America wrote:
As I said in the beginning, Mr Values, you need to check you own values. Really,your not gonna bully me around with your empty words.

And for sure, you are not gonna "gaslight" me. If you try to "Gaslight" anyone els...I WILL point it out.

I hope in future posts that you claim that what you say is your opinion...unless of coarse you can prove it.

Hope the next convo goes better :-)

Peter

Whoever hacked Peter needs to work on their grammer :lol:


grammar :wink:

Sorry, couldn't resist. :lol:

Welcome to the forum! :up

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 23 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
POWERED_BY