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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:07 pm 
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About the Fair Tax

What is the FairTax plan?

The FairTax plan is a comprehensive proposal that replaces all federal income and payroll based taxes with an integrated approach including a progressive national retail sales tax, a prebate to ensure no American pays federal taxes on spending up to the poverty level, dollar-for-dollar federal revenue neutrality, and, through companion legislation, the repeal of the 16th Amendment.

The FairTax Act (HR 25, S 1025) is nonpartisan legislation. It abolishes all federal personal and corporate income taxes, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, and self-employment taxes and replaces them with one simple, visible, federal retail sales tax administered primarily by existing state sales tax authorities.

The FairTax taxes us only on what we choose to spend on new goods or services, not on what we earn. The FairTax is a fair, efficient, transparent, and intelligent solution to the frustration and inequity of our current tax system.

The FairTax:
* Abolishes the IRS
* Closes all loopholes and brings fairness to taxation
* Ensures Social Security and Medicare funding
* Brings transparency and accountability to tax policy
* Allows American products to compete fairly
* Reimburses the tax on purchases of basic necessities
* Enables retirees to keep their entire pension
* Enables workers to keep their entire paycheck

Please visit http://www.fairtax.org to learn more.


Fair Tax Vs. Flat Tax
http://www.pafairtax.org/resrcs/FlatTax ... arison.pdf


Defending the Fair Tax (Rebuttals)
http://tinyurl.com/yox5hq


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:29 pm 
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I cant stress enough how each Huckabee supporter should know the ins and outs of the Fair tax. This is a great Ice breaker when you want to speak to someone who generally feels uncomfortable talking politics at the office or where ever.

Let me give an example. This past Friday was payday, my colleagues hate talking politics so i decided to try something to see if I can get Mike Huckabee's name out there. I looked at my paycheck and I thought out loud about how I hate taxes and they take too much and how I wish we had the fair tax. My Colleagues sitting next to me agreed, they also asked me about the fair tax because they had no idea what it was or how it works. Once I explained to them how the fair tax worked they were very positive about it, One of them then asked me... so why isn't anyone supporting this idea..... and of course I followed up with " well yes there is someone"... He just happens to be running for president (wink, wink)... so now they both know Mike's name and maybe they might even catch themselves going to his website. Not to toot my own horn, but You see how clever, and subtle that whole scenario was? 8)


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:48 pm 
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Thankyoo so much for posting this, I have had several people ask me about the Fair Tax but I knew little and was unable to give good answers. I have now read fairtax.org and now know enough to tell people what this is about. Thanks.


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 Post subject: Misunderstood sometimes
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2007 7:54 pm 
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I think many people misunderstand the fair tax. Of those I've spoken with, many expressed concern about the middle class and poor, as they figured the fair tax would make it much tougher. But, based on what I've read on-line and what some experts have said, it's seems as though the fair tax would make it easier because of the pre-bates. Agree?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:45 pm 
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:( Well you see the pre-bate is what gets most critics talking some say it can't be done accurately enough to help...


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:47 am 
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We also have this thread on the FairTax that answers several questions. If you find an answer there, great, if not, just post it here.
We don't have the ability to merge threads yet, but let's try to avoid duplicate posts!

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:07 pm 
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Guys go to this website... and decide for yourself if the pre-bates work out... here's the pre-bate calculator
http://www.fairtaxcalculator.org/


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:56 pm 
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Those who are negative towards the prebate are so for three reasons.
First, they consider it too expensive and impossible to coordinate.
Second, they consider it a welfare program for government dependency.
Third, they would rather just not tax basic necessities.

To answer them:
First, the government already has all the records necessary to figure the prebate. It's a standard amount depending only on household size. No impossible calculations are necessary. There are also a couple major credit card companies that are offering to PAY the government for the privelege of disbursing the prebates onto cards owned by them. In today's electronic banking age, the cost associated with disbursing the funds is extremely low.
Second, it isn't welfare since everybody gets it. People are no more dependant on the prebate than they are on their standard or itemized deductions or tax credits they currently get. Are you going to call the mortgage interest deduction welfare? Me thinks not.
Third, if you remove the tax on food, for example, the fairtax rate on everything else will have to be much higher. The goal of the FairTax is to make the base as large as possible so the rate can be lower. Further, if you don't tax food, then the poor guy buying rice a roni won't get taxed, but neither will the millionaire buying 10k worth of steak for a party. That is hardly a necessity at that point. Everyone gets the basics and decides for themselves what is a necessity. Above that? You buy, you pay. Fair indeed.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 6:48 pm 
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Excellent Christian! Thanks for the simple (for the simple-minded like me) analogies. I'll use it. I had a pre-tax debate today already. I wasn't prepared with the 67 sponsors to it (when he argued it would never fly), but I am now.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:40 am 
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God's Girl,
Glad to help. Feel free to come to me with any questions you or your friends have.
You are NOT simple minded. You support Huckabee don't you? :D
To your point about sponsorship. I always start a discussion on the FairTax with something along the lines of, "The FairTax is a bill before congress right now with 67 cosponsors. This is something real, not just one crazy guy in the back with his hand up going "oooh! Oooh! Wouldn't this be cool!".

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:58 pm 
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I posted some comments following this blog here:

http://arkansansforhuckabee.blogspot.co ... -part.html

Please read and feel free to discuss ways to pitch the FAIR TAX as part of a greater narrative that appeals to all Americans. I think that this tax/economic issue has the potential to be one of the compelling themes that invites and unites everyone to get behind Gov Huckabee's vision for a better America.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 5:01 pm 
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Brently,
Nice job in your response to that post.
I wrote the following:

Brently,
Awesome post!
One thing we forget is that one of the primary causes of divorce and other family strife is financial issues. That's the stress causer. (I know from personal experience.) I would argue that by creating a strong and vibrant economy by doing things the government can do (like passing the FairTax) then that makes it easier for families to thrive. And the government can't mandate a "happy, loving, marriage". If only it were so easy.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 12:56 am 
This is one of the issues that I have with Huckabee. I cant support the Fair Tax. For many years I worked on a delivery company and we went into so many retail stores and I found out how many people sold items that were high volume but never rang them in the register. the reason I was told was that those items were lower profit, so they didnt ring them up but charges sales tax. That gave them an extra 7%. If the Fair tax was instituted, then that would mean an extra 23%. If the theft of sales tax is moderatly low know, I dont think it will be for long.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 1:00 am 
btw, a much better system and one that Huck should get behind is the APT tax.

This is the simplest, fairest and will make more money then any tax system and best of all, allot of the tax is paid by foreigners that do business in the US. Instead of them coming to our country and making money, then leaving. They will pay a tax on every transaction.
I really wish that Huckabee would at least look at this.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 1:12 am 
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The key to establishing the Fair Tax is the repeal of the 16th Amendment. Otherwise, we’ll be taxed on two fronts. This will be no small task.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 3:14 am 
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IspadeHuck,
The fraud now under the current system is rampant and costs hundreds of billions of dollars a year. People either cheat on purpose or don't know the rules (who does!) well enough to comply. By removing the personal requirement to file income tax, the government is more easily able to monitor business compliance of the FairTax...for less cost. Since businesses must file records on all wholesale transactions in order to avoid paying the fairtax at purchase, if they are selling goods but not charging for them, the "blip" in the system will be apparent. They will be caught and punished.

Jdbrown,
HR25 itself does not call for the repeal of the 16th amendment. It is, however, the ultimate goal of most of it's supporters.
The reason it isn't in the legislation is because then, rather than a simple majority needed to pass, it becomes a Constitutional amendment requiring not only a two-thirds vote from Congress, but then 3/4's of the states to ratify it. Frankly, this isn't an easy process!
To put your mind at ease, however, lets look at the argument. They say, "Unless you repeal the 16th amendment, you will have both a sales tax and an income tax!". Well, in all honesty, nothing is preventing that from happening now. Instituting a sales tax on top of the current income tax is perfectly allowable under current law. We don't have it because Congress realizes the people wouldn't stand for it.
Because the FairTax legislation in it's very first section deletes most all the current tax code from the law books, after the FairTax passed the only way you could have an income tax again would be for Congress to vote for it to be reinstalled in the law books. Again, the same forces preventing them from adding a sales tax now would be in place preventing them from adding an income tax after the FairTax.
Is removing the 16th amendment a great idea? Absolutely! But it isn't a deal breaker. And frankly, once people enjoy living under the FairTax, the movement to repeal the 16th would only grow.
Hope that helps, if not just post again!

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:40 am 
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IspadeHuck wrote:
This is one of the issues that I have with Huckabee. I cant support the Fair Tax. For many years I worked on a delivery company and we went into so many retail stores and I found out how many people sold items that were high volume but never rang them in the register. the reason I was told was that those items were lower profit, so they didnt ring them up but charges sales tax. That gave them an extra 7%. If the Fair tax was instituted, then that would mean an extra 23%. If the theft of sales tax is moderatly low know, I dont think it will be for long.


Individual states should police their own state sales tax. However, they lack the incentive. Once the state is going to receive their commission for the collection processes of the Fair Tax, they will be in a much better position to catch the cheaters. (Calif would receive enough commission from the Fair Tax to totally fund their newly expanded Revenue Department for both state and federal tax collections.)

When a business has a lot of purchases and is not reporting their total sales taxes, the state revenue department will be able to catch them. It will be in their interest to go after the cheaters. (unreported sales). If it is a small "mom/pop business" the overall amount of unreported taxes would come no where close to the unreported taxes lost under the current income tax system.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:05 am 
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Amen ChiefCook, great point.
And it's not only the state agency that receives commission on collection, but the businesses themselves receive a commission, thereby once again only encouraging compliance!
Thanks.
FairTax NOW!

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:10 pm 
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Go to this thread to read a great post found in a blog of a New Hampshire newspaper. It is the second post: http://forum.hucksarmy.com/viewtopic.php?t=738

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:33 pm 
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There is a user on the Fair Tax board that posted a thread about the video hit piece:

http://fairtaxgroups.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=f4f23c33aac0394885e5605dd47d2d92&topic=2472.from1194896455;topicseen

anyone with an account, go reply to this troll.

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