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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 2:53 pm 
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TheValuesVoter wrote:
If somehow I had ended up emerging from a physical confrontation in which the person I was fighting with was mortally wounded by a gun that I owned - I can only imagine the panic I'd feel. I can imagine my whole life - and the threat of prison - flashing in front of me. And I would be very tempted to present a story and to find every piece of information that could show that I was absolutely justified in my actions and not at fault in any way. And I'd be very tempted to present that story whether or not that was true. Wouldn't you?
That's definitely a plausible scenario. We will see if the witnesses can shed on any light on this. Given that the prosecutor pressed charges, I have to believe there is more evidence than what we know publicly, but if not the case seems weak at this point.

I have a suspicion that we will never have enough objective evidence to know for sure one way or the other, but I will be interested to see what is presented in court.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 5:02 pm 
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Looking over the image from ABC News:

Image

I have a few questions/comments:
1) This copy of the image was generated from the computer program Adobe Photoshop CS5 running on a Macintosh. This in itself means nothing because they probably used Photoshop in order to add the "ABC News Exclusive" icon. But it would be very educational to get a copy of the original photo. ABC News could release this to the public without compromising the identity of the person who provided it to them. This copy of the image shown above has no coordinates and no timestamp and doesn't give any information about the type of hardware that was used to capture it. This is not the original image but a copy someone at ABC put together from the alleged image and their logo. There is no metadata in this image at all to suggest where and when it was taken.

2) Since ABC News claims that the original photo, which we haven't seen yet, has geocoordinates, it would seem that the photo was taken from a cell phone camera. A few things that pop to my mind include:

a) Is the fidelity of the original image consistent with that which would be expected from a cell phone image.

b) How much more is there in the original picture beyond what the ABC News Photoshop copy has in it? Is there anything in the background that could be used to confirm visually that the picture was taken where the timestamp suggests that it was?

c) I'd be curious to get the opinion of a medical person who saw the picture as to how serious this wound would appear to be and how possible it would be for Zimmerman to be able to function as well as we saw him (walking, getting out of the police car under his own power while handcuffed) in the video which was taken about 30 minutes after this photograph was allegedly taken.

d) I'd also be curious to get the opinion of people in law enforcement about whether or not they would take a person who looked like this to the hospital before taking them to a police precinct. After all, most people who commit crimes, if they themselves are seriously injured in the process, are taken to the hospital and put under guard until they are well enough to be formally charged and taken into custody. Why would a person who looked like the person in the picture looked not get rushed to the hospital themselves?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:05 am 
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TheValuesVoter wrote:
Looking over the image from ABC News:

Image

I have a few questions/comments:
1) This copy of the image was generated from the computer program Adobe Photoshop CS5 running on a Macintosh. This in itself means nothing because they probably used Photoshop in order to add the "ABC News Exclusive" icon. But it would be very educational to get a copy of the original photo. ABC News could release this to the public without compromising the identity of the person who provided it to them. This copy of the image shown above has no coordinates and no timestamp and doesn't give any information about the type of hardware that was used to capture it. This is not the original image but a copy someone at ABC put together from the alleged image and their logo. There is no metadata in this image at all to suggest where and when it was taken.

2) Since ABC News claims that the original photo, which we haven't seen yet, has geocoordinates, it would seem that the photo was taken from a cell phone camera. A few things that pop to my mind include:

a) Is the fidelity of the original image consistent with that which would be expected from a cell phone image.

b) How much more is there in the original picture beyond what the ABC News Photoshop copy has in it? Is there anything in the background that could be used to confirm visually that the picture was taken where the timestamp suggests that it was?

c) I'd be curious to get the opinion of a medical person who saw the picture as to how serious this wound would appear to be and how possible it would be for Zimmerman to be able to function as well as we saw him (walking, getting out of the police car under his own power while handcuffed) in the video which was taken about 30 minutes after this photograph was allegedly taken.

d) I'd also be curious to get the opinion of people in law enforcement about whether or not they would take a person who looked like this to the hospital before taking them to a police precinct. After all, most people who commit crimes, if they themselves are seriously injured in the process, are taken to the hospital and put under guard until they are well enough to be formally charged and taken into custody. Why would a person who looked like the person in the picture looked not get rushed to the hospital themselves?


My husband is an EMT and they are usually the ones (along with the medics) who make the call of whether or not to take someone to the hospital. I can tell you that 99% of the time, they take them to the hospital just because of the liability that the city incurs if they don't take them. He's taken many folks accused of robbery to the hospital with "chest pains" because they think they will escape prosecution by going to the ER. But we don't live in FL so I can't say what the protocol there entails.

Head wounds do bleed a lot so a great amount of blood doesn't necessarily indicate the seriousness of the injury. I would think that a possible concussion would warrant at least a trip to the ER. That being said though, if Zimmerman thought he was OK and signed a waiver, he could have refused additional medical treatment though it was advised by EMT's/medics. That relieves the medical personnel from any liability. Just more unanswered questions. . .

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:19 pm 
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brownkb wrote:
Head wounds do bleed a lot so a great amount of blood doesn't necessarily indicate the seriousness of the injury. I would think that a possible concussion would warrant at least a trip to the ER. That being said though, if Zimmerman thought he was OK and signed a waiver, he could have refused additional medical treatment though it was advised by EMT's/medics. That relieves the medical personnel from any liability. Just more unanswered questions. . .


I talked a little earlier with a friend of mine who was a police officer in central Florida for a number of years. He is familiar with Seminole County and also with the Sanford PD. I asked him about his opinion about the photograph and about the case in general.

He also said that head wounds tend to produce a lot of blood and that, assuming that the photo is real, that this wound didn't seem "all that bad" (I was surprised at his answer - it looks bad to me). He noted that the trail of blood seems to have dried up before it got to his shirt, which he says would not be the case in a situation in which the wound was on the more serious end of the spectrum.

He said that it wouldn't have been his call as a police officer to determine whether or not the person needed to be taken to the hospital but that a medical person would do that. But he did say that if a person was seriously injured, the general protocol is that they have to go to the hospital first.

What surprised me is that he commented on the allegations that Zimmerman's nose was broken more than the head wound. He said that a jail would not accept an individual who was injured and that if his nose was broken (assuming that they could tell that it was), he would have to be given prompt medical assistance first.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:40 pm 
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In addition to the possibility of Zimmerman's account of the night being accurate, here is another alternate theory as to what could have taken place that night:

Zimmerman is driving to Target when he sees Martin, whom he does not know, walking into the neighborhood. He begins observing and following Martin. He thinks to himself "who is that guy? I wonder if he has anything to do with all the robberies that have been going on in this neighborhood?"

Martin is walking back from the store, on the phone with his girlfriend when he notices that a strange man in an unmarked car is following him. He thinks to himself "who is that guy and why is he driving slow and following me? Dad told me that there have been a lot of robberies in this neighborhood. I'm all by myself out here. I wonder if he's going to try to rob me?"

Zimmerman gets out of his car in order to try to track Martin. Zimmerman, from his phone conversation with the 911 operators, is convinced that Martin is up to no good.

Martin sees Zimmerman following him on foot and headed directly toward him. He thinks to himself "he IS going to try to rob me!!"

Unknown words are exchanged between the two young men. At some point in time, they get into some form of a physical confrontation. Perhaps they each sincerely believe at that point that each other are there to do the other harm, even though neither had the intent of getting into a confrontation or breaking any law just moments before.

At some point during their physical confrontation, Zimmerman's firearm falls to the ground.

Martin sees the firearm. "He's got a gun? He's going to kill me. I need to grab that gun or he's going to shoot me."

Zimmerman sees that Martin sees his gun and that he is going to grab it. "I need my gun."

The two young men are now engaged in a wrestling match for the gun. Each of them is desperately attempting to wrestle the gun out of the other's hands. At this point in time, people can hear one of the men calling desperately for help. Zimmerman's family claims that it is his voice. Martin's family claims that it's his voice. Two voice analysts and a witness claimed that it was not Zimmerman's voice and there may be other witnesses claiming something else.

BAM!!

Zimmerman managed to get control of the gun. But now he is stunned to realize that he shot someone who is now dying. In order for him to not be charged with murder, he needs to make the case that he was in the course of defending his life, whether or not that is the truth, as he claims, or whether the truth was something more like what is described above.

Just another way of looking at what could have taken place.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:56 pm 
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TheValuesVoter wrote:
In addition to the possibility of Zimmerman's account of the night being accurate, here is another alternate theory as to what could have taken place that night:

Zimmerman is driving to Target when he sees Martin, whom he does not know, walking into the neighborhood. He begins observing and following Martin. He thinks to himself "who is that guy? I wonder if he has anything to do with all the robberies that have been going on in this neighborhood?"

Martin is walking back from the store, on the phone with his girlfriend when he notices that a strange man in an unmarked car is following him. He thinks to himself "who is that guy and why is he driving slow and following me? Dad told me that there have been a lot of robberies in this neighborhood. I'm all by myself out here. I wonder if he's going to try to rob me?"

Zimmerman gets out of his car in order to try to track Martin. Zimmerman, from his phone conversation with the 911 operators, is convinced that Martin is up to no good.

Martin sees Zimmerman following him on foot and headed directly toward him. He thinks to himself "he IS going to try to rob me!!"

Unknown words are exchanged between the two young men. At some point in time, they get into some form of a physical confrontation. Perhaps they each sincerely believe at that point that each other are there to do the other harm, even though neither had the intent of getting into a confrontation or breaking any law just moments before.

At some point during their physical confrontation, Zimmerman's firearm falls to the ground.

Martin sees the firearm. "He's got a gun? He's going to kill me. I need to grab that gun or he's going to shoot me."

Zimmerman sees that Martin sees his gun and that he is going to grab it. "I need my gun."

The two young men are now engaged in a wrestling match for the gun. Each of them is desperately attempting to wrestle the gun out of the other's hands. At this point in time, people can hear one of the men calling desperately for help. Zimmerman's family claims that it is his voice. Martin's family claims that it's his voice. Two voice analysts and a witness claimed that it was not Zimmerman's voice and there may be other witnesses claiming something else.

BAM!!

Zimmerman managed to get control of the gun. But now he is stunned to realize that he shot someone who is now dying. In order for him to not be charged with murder, he needs to make the case that he was in the course of defending his life, whether or not that is the truth, as he claims, or whether the truth was something more like what is described above.

Just another way of looking at what could have taken place.


It seems that if this scenario is true, then the killing of Martin would be in self-defense.

Because if Zimmerman's gun fell to the ground and Martin went for it, then Zimmerman had every reason to believe that Martin would use it (whether he really would have or not, we don't know). Which then if Zimmerman was able to get the gun back (after it fell to the ground), and Martin still fought for it, and Zimmerman fired...then the shooting would be self-defense.

Isn't this essentially what you are saying in your scenario, or am I not understanding correctly?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:10 am 
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TVV, that sounds like a very plausible scenario I think! Could just have been a case of confusion.

I haven't really commented on anything for a long time here - I got tired of the presidential race and I'm happy the primary is more or less over. I'm finishing up my bachelor's degree and I'm moving to England this fall to do a master's degree and possibly a PhD. Needless to say, I've been quite busy.

What I mostly dislike about this case is how the media is already pushing the line about how Zimmerman is guilty, instead of waiting for the court to do its work. I don't know if he is, I'm just saying the media frenzy is mad. They're really willing to do anything to sell papers and get ratings, including condemning a man who hasn't even had a trial yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:11 am 
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ohiorepublican09 wrote:
It seems that if this scenario is true, then the killing of Martin would be in self-defense.

Because if Zimmerman's gun fell to the ground and Martin went for it, then Zimmerman had every reason to believe that Martin would use it (whether he really would have or not, we don't know). Which then if Zimmerman was able to get the gun back (after it fell to the ground), and Martin still fought for it, and Zimmerman fired...then the shooting would be self-defense.

Isn't this essentially what you are saying in your scenario, or am I not understanding correctly?


If this scenario reflects what happened this night, assuming thta the two young men were fighting for the gun and one of them was shot in the struggle, there could have been two possible outcomes:

* Trayvon Martin, if he had shot Zimmerman, could have claimed self defense as he would argue that he had reason to believe that Zimmerman was trying to kill him. After all, Zimmerman was the one who followed him and was armed. Martin could have claimed that Zimmerman was the aggressor and that he was trying to defend himself. And I don't think that he would be successful in arguing that defense because, the state might argue, once he possessed the gun, he would have had other options than to fire at and kill Zimmerman. Also, at the end of the day, a person would have been killed - a 28-year old man who, although he had made some mistakes in life, had a promising future.

* George Zimmerman is claiming self defense after having shot and killed Martin. Likewise, the state will probably argue that, if this scenario reflects the evidence of that night, that once Zimmerman possessed the gun, he would have had other options than to fire at and kill Martin. Also, the fact that Zimmerman could be argued to have initiated the confrontation by getting out of his car in order to seek out Martin on foot, will probably work against him. Also, at the end of the day, a person has been killed - a 17-year old boy who, although he had made some mistakes in life, had a promising future.

I think that if both of these guys were in a scenario in which they were struggling for a gun, in a mistaken belief that the other was a criminal, whoever shot and killed the other person would be charged with either manslaughter or murder. Do you think that if circumstances were different and Martin had shot Zimmerman, claiming self-defense, that he would escape prosecution and conviction?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:25 am 
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Wendero wrote:
TVV, that sounds like a very plausible scenario I think! Could just have been a case of confusion.

I haven't really commented on anything for a long time here - I got tired of the presidential race and I'm happy the primary is more or less over. I'm finishing up my bachelor's degree and I'm moving to England this fall to do a master's degree and possibly a PhD. Needless to say, I've been quite busy.


Congratulations!!! That is an awesome personal accomplishment and I wish you the best!

Quote:
What I mostly dislike about this case is how the media is already pushing the line about how Zimmerman is guilty, instead of waiting for the court to do its work. I don't know if he is, I'm just saying the media frenzy is mad. They're really willing to do anything to sell papers and get ratings, including condemning a man who hasn't even had a trial yet.


The media pretty much takes one side or the other on every high profile case ... not just this one.

I think that the public reaction to this case would have been much different had Zimmerman been charged a long time ago and his innocence or guilt could have begun being determined through the judicial system sooner. Chances are that we would not have heard about this case. I think the outrage came largely out of the fact that a man shot a boy and hadn't even officially been determined to have committed a crime.

I think that the best thing that could possibly happen for everybody is just to get the absolute, unbiased truth about what happened that night and that there is a fair, transparent and complete legal process to determine exactly what happened - whether that means that Zimmerman is innocent or guilty. Everybody loses when innocent people are convicted or when guilty people go free.

But the scenario I brought up earlier poses an ambiguity. If both men somehow ended up struggling for the gun with the belief that the other was trying to shoot them, that would mean that in either case, either Zimmerman or Martin - neither of whom was in the commission of a crime and thus would both have been entitled to argue that they were acting in self-defense - could have killed the other and had a legal ground to claim they were defending themselves. Wouldn't that be crazy? If there is a situation in which two people can both have the legal right to kill each other because they can claim that the other is threatening their life - I think that's a situation in which there is a glaring, insane legal ambiguity that needs to be immediately corrected. It's a little scary, to be honest with you.

You run into a guy on the street. He looks at you and assumes you're going to hurt him. You see his eyes and think he's going to hurt you. You exchange words and then the exchange turns physical. Whoever is losing the fight could claim that they believe they were in great danger of injury or death and kill the other and actually have the potential of being immune from prosecution. They both have the right to kill each other in that scenario. It just seems insane to me but maybe it makes sense to someone else.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:40 am 
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http://www2.wkrg.com/news/2012/apr/23/m ... r-3659891/

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Man Beaten By Mob, In Critical Condition

By: WKRG Staff | WKRG
Published: April 23, 2012

MOBILE, Alabama --

Mobile police need your help to catch a mob that beat Matthew Owens so badly that he's in critical condition.

According to police, Owens fussed at some kids playing basketball in the middle of Delmar Drive about 8:30 Saturday night. They say the kids left and a group of adults returned, armed with everything but the kitchen sink.

Police tell News 5 the suspects used chairs, pipes and paint cans to beat Owens.

Owens' sister, Ashley Parker, saw the attack. "It was the scariest thing I have ever witnessed." Parker says 20 people, all African American, attacked her brother on the front porch of his home, using "brass buckles, paint cans and anything they could get their hands on."

Police will only say "multiple people" are involved.

What Parker says happened next could make the fallout from the brutal beating even worse. As the attackers walked away, leaving Owen bleeding on the ground, Parker says one of them said, "Now that's justice for Trayvon."

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:20 am 
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All-in-for-Mike wrote:
http://www2.wkrg.com/news/2012/apr/23/man-beaten-mob-critical-condition-ar-3659891/

Quote:
Man Beaten By Mob, In Critical Condition

By: WKRG Staff | WKRG
Published: April 23, 2012

MOBILE, Alabama --

Mobile police need your help to catch a mob that beat Matthew Owens so badly that he's in critical condition.

According to police, Owens fussed at some kids playing basketball in the middle of Delmar Drive about 8:30 Saturday night. They say the kids left and a group of adults returned, armed with everything but the kitchen sink.

Police tell News 5 the suspects used chairs, pipes and paint cans to beat Owens.

Owens' sister, Ashley Parker, saw the attack. "It was the scariest thing I have ever witnessed." Parker says 20 people, all African American, attacked her brother on the front porch of his home, using "brass buckles, paint cans and anything they could get their hands on."

Police will only say "multiple people" are involved.

What Parker says happened next could make the fallout from the brutal beating even worse. As the attackers walked away, leaving Owen bleeding on the ground, Parker says one of them said, "Now that's justice for Trayvon."


Absolutely sickening and very sad. Our society cannot have any place for this kind of unprovoked attack.

The "justice for Trayvon" comment, if it can be proven, is clear evidence that bias was a motivation for the crime, making it a hate crime (people of any color can be charged witih a hate crime if there is evidence that racial bias against the victim, regardless of the victim's color, was a motivation for the crime. The key factor is the intent of the crime). It should be charged as such. Everybody who commits a violent crime in which there is evidence that the motivation for the crime is racial hatred should be charged with a hate crime. It does not matter according to the law whether it is a white person attacking a black person because of racial hatred, a black person attacking a white person because of racial hatred, or any other perpetrator/victim racial demographic combination.

We do have the capacity to prosecute multiple crimes concurrently and so no crime should take the focus away from any other. We can simultaneously work for justice in the shooting of Martin (which I don't believe, based on the evidence, was bias-related) while aggressively seeking the perpetrators of this crime and bringing them to justice.

I'm pretty confident that, although they don't have anybody yet, that they will bring the perpetrators to justice. The greater the number of people who are involced in a crime, the greater the chance that somebody who is willing to talk knows something and that somebody will make a mistake or turn themselves in. I would bet that this crime will be solved and that the people who perpetrated it will be held fully accountable by the law.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." - Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:53 am 
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What Parker says happened next could make the fallout from the brutal beating even worse. As the attackers walked away, leaving Owen bleeding on the ground, Parker says one of them said, "Now that's justice for Trayvon."


So it's justice to beat a white male when a hispanic male killed Trayvon?

Where is the conscious of men? I feel bad if I accidentally step on the dog's tail.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:00 am 
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conservativevoter wrote:
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What Parker says happened next could make the fallout from the brutal beating even worse. As the attackers walked away, leaving Owen bleeding on the ground, Parker says one of them said, "Now that's justice for Trayvon."


So it's justice to beat a white male when a hispanic male killed Trayvon?

Where is the conscious of men? I feel bad if I accidentally step on the dog's tail.


Of course it isn't. And I'm sure that Martin's family would be horrified at the thought of these thugs even mentioning their son's name.

Obviously, people who could gang up on and severely beat an individual, regardless of their color or his, don't have a functioning conscience. And it takes a great degree of cowardice to be part of a group that attacks an individual in any situation.

Fortunately, these types of cowards don't often get away with their crimes. Too many people were involved. My guess is that they'll all be caught, all face substantial prison time and at least won't be able to do this to anyone else.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:59 am 
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TheValuesVoter wrote:
conservativevoter wrote:
Quote:
What Parker says happened next could make the fallout from the brutal beating even worse. As the attackers walked away, leaving Owen bleeding on the ground, Parker says one of them said, "Now that's justice for Trayvon."


So it's justice to beat a white male when a hispanic male killed Trayvon?

Where is the conscious of men? I feel bad if I accidentally step on the dog's tail.


Of course it isn't. And I'm sure that Martin's family would be horrified at the thought of these thugs even mentioning their son's name.

Well, I've been waiting to hear Trayvon's family speak out against all the thuggery that's been done in their son's name. Where was their public condemnation of the bounty put on Zimmerman's head? Or Spike Lee tweeting what he thought was Zimmerman's home address? Where is their statement that says, "Please remain calm and don't retaliate on behalf of our son"? Where is the Martin family's statement decrying the above-referenced story, where a mob of ADULTS attacks and brutally beats someone, then says it's 'justice' for Travyon??

I haven't heard of any such statements. If they've given such statements, I'm eager to be corrected. All I've heard from the family is that they officially trademarked Trayvon's name, and the slogan "Justice for Trayvon."

When Zimmerman was arrested, Trayvon's parents gave a press conference and his mother tearfully said, "All we wanted was an arrest." Well, what does that mean? Do they want the facts to come out, or just get Zimmerman behind bars? What if he gets arrested, has a trial, and gets acquitted? Is that "justice"? Or is justice only served if Zimmerman is punished?

(see following post)

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:03 am 
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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/04/25/de ... latestnews
Quote:
Dershowitz: Prosecutor in Trayvon Martin case overreached with murder charge

By Greg Wilson

Published April 25, 2012

FoxNews.com

Legal legend Alan Dershowitz blasted the special prosecutor in the Trayvon Martin case, accusing her of hiding evidence favorable to defendant George Zimmerman and committing perjury.

“If I were this prosecutor, I’d be hiring a lawyer at this point,” Dershowitz said of Angela Cory, the Florida state attorney and special prosecutor who Gov. Rick Scott appointed to handle the case.

Dershowitz leveled his bombshell charges in an interview Wednesday with Fox News' Megyn Kelly. The Harvard law professor, noted for winning an acquittal of Claus Von Bulow in the case that inspired the film “Reversal of Fortune,” said Cory overreached by charging Zimmerman with second-degree murder. And he said the affidavit she filed in support of the charges was illegal because it did not include evidence favorable to Zimmerman.

“This affidavit submitted by the prosecutor in the Florida case is a crime,” Dershowitz said. “It’s a crime.”

Zimmerman, 28, is a neighborhood watch captain who admits shooting the unarmed 17-year-old Martin on Feb. 26 after a confrontation in the gated community where he lives, but Zimmerman claims he acted in self-defense.

ABC News recently aired a photo purportedly taken minutes after the shooting that shows a bloody wound on the back of Zimmerman’s head. That photo appears to support Zimmerman’s contention that he was being beaten by the teen when he shot him.

But Cory made no mention of Zimmerman’s wounds or photos that might substantiate them when announcing the charge on April 11. Dershowitz said she was obligated to include any and all pertinent evidence.

“If she in fact knew about ABC News’ pictures of the bloody head of Zimmerman and failed to include that in the affidavit, this affidavit is not the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth,” Dershowitz said. “It’s a perjurious affidavit.”

Even worse, Dershowitz warned that by overcharging Zimmerman, Cory may have planted the seed for riots if he is acquitted, as Dershowitz predicted will happen.

“If there are riots, it will be the prosecutor’s fault because she overcharged, raised expectations,” Dershowitz said. “This prosecutor not only may have suborned perjury, she may be responsible, if there are going to be riots here, for raising expectations to unreasonable levels.”


He said it is quite possible Zimmerman was guilty of a lesser charge, but the affidavit does not support a second-degree murder charge.

“There’s nothing in this affidavit that suggests second-degree murder. The elements of second-degree murder aren’t here."

Dershowitz is not the first legal expert to question the second-degree murder charge. The Florida statute requires proof that the defendant acted in a manner that was “evincing a depraved mind.” Prominent Miami criminal defense attorney John Priovolos told The Associated Press the charge was a “huge overreach” and said Corey will be hard-pressed to show Zimmerman had the “ill will, spite, malice or hatred” needed to prove a “depraved mind.”

If convicted of the second-degree charge, Zimmerman could face a maximum sentence of life in prison. Cory could still add charges, and a jury could eventually convict him of a “lesser included” charge, such as reckless manslaughter.

When announcing the charge, Cory expressed confidence in her team’s case.

"We have to have a reasonable certainty of conviction before filing charges," Cory said.

But Dershowitz said Cory is the one who should be facing charges, arguing that her prosecution of the case has already taken a political turn.

“She was appointed to get Zimmerman,” Dershowitz said.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/04/25/de ... z1t7TkOl99

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:37 am 
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Martin's parents have repeatedly urged for peaceful reactions to the case.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-trayvon-martin-plea-for-peace-20120411,0,5672610.story

Quote:
Martin's parents and their attorney are pleading, even begging, for a peaceful reaction as the nation waits to hear whether charges will be filed against Zimmerman, who has admitted shooting and killing Martin -- but insists it was only in self-defense.

Attorney Benjamin Crump, flanked by Martin's parents, asked for the public's reaction to any pending development in the case to be "peaceful and responsible" and said he was begging that "nothing gets out of hand." He also pleaded with the public to use the grieving parents as their example.

"They are such a good example of keeping your composure," he said, adding that despite all the outrage surrounding the case, no one can be in more pain than the parents who lost a child. "If they can continue to carry themselves in a dignified manner, we all should."


Their repeated pleas for peace are also referenced in this article http://www.bet.com/news/national/2012/04/25/trayvon-martin-s-death-sparks-violence.html, which also mentions a case of a black person who was charged with a hate crime for a racially motivated attack on a white person - yes, it does work both ways, as it should when bias is the motivation for a crime.

They also told the Black Panthers, the ones who put a bounty on Zimmerman, that they wanted nothing to do with them at all and that they wanted them to go away.

Honestly, folks, I really do not understand the hostile reaction to the victim's parents or to Trayvon Martin himself. I don't know where that part is coming from. Where is this coming from?

I think that very few of us have lost a child. A minor child. In a high profile case. And I'm sure that Martin's parents probably, in the midst of all their grieving and the continual attacks on their son's character (by some people who are determined to find him guilty of a crime - including some white supremacists who hacked his email account) and on his name (by thuggish idiots who have been committing these crimes while claiming to be getting "justice" for him), probably can't keep up with the kooks on both sides of the issue who are taking every opportunity to show their ignorance and hatred. I guess between bouts of depression over losing their child and their dreams for his future, repeatedly condemning the violent acts of a few criminals who probably would have committed them anyway, and the details of the legal case against their son's killer, they should probably spend more time on twitter issuing repeated statements to condemn the next nutbag who does something crazy. If you were in their position, how much of your time would you take away from your grieving and your quest for justice to keep asking people over and over again to not be morons?

I see so much ugliness and division about this case coming - from both sides of the issue, actually - and it's so not necessary. I think that all decent people want to see people who attack innocent people, regardless of the skin colors of the people involved, put away for a long time. I think all decent people want to know why Trayvon Martin was killed and for justice to be done in that case. Anything else that's coming out of this - deep-seated racial resentment coming from both blacks and whites alike - is definitely not helpful to America - and is also not of God.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 7:04 am 
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Yeah, I don't think Trayvon's parents need to make public statements about everything being said about this case. Coping with the loss of their son and pursuing what they believe is justice for him is more than enough for them to have to deal with. There are plenty of people who are willing and able to address all of the peripheral issues around this case.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:58 pm 
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TVV, I'm VERY glad to hear that they've called for calm. somehow in the media frenzy, I'd missed those statements. I'm truly pleased and happy to hear that. Thank you for researching and posting the links.

I wonder if some of the reaction to the parents is a cumulative backlash against things that OTHER minority people have done in the past, like Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Tawana Brawley, the Duke rape case, OJ Simpson, Sheila Jackson-Lee, Frederica wilson, Corrinne Brown, etc. Each one sometimes seems like another brick in the wall. People like this set back the cause of racial harmony by years each time they open their mouths.

And I'm quite certain that a lot of the African-American reaction to the case is a cumulative reaction to white-against-black racism & violence throughout our nation's past. Even though Zimmerman is Hispanic, early media reports called him "white," and that was all it took. It only takes a tiny spark when the tinder is that dry.

To this day, there are still dynamic repercussions from the MLK assassination, the ensuing riots, and the Rodney King beating.

Some day I'll post all that my family and I have been through in the area of racial relations. It's been quite a journey for me. I've battled hard to keep my kids open-hearted in this area. We've all been through a lot and many tears have been shed. God is grieved. Racism is definitely a two-way street. I have seen it with my own eyes and heard it with my own ears.

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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 11:40 pm 
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http://www.mediacomtoday.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CD9UPEE703%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018

Quote:
MIAMI (AP)
Records detail George Zimmerman's medical injuries
The Associated Press
Tuesday, May 15, 2012 8:59 PM EDT
— Court records show George Zimmerman had a pair of black eyes, a nose fracture and two cuts to the back of his head after the fatal shooting of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin.

ABC News reports ( abcn.ws/K3tcvN) the medical records were part of evidence released Tuesday that prosecutors have in the second-degree murder case against Zimmerman. He has entered a plea of not guilty and claims self-defense in the Feb. 26 shooting. A message left Tuesday evening with Zimmerman's attorney was not immediately returned.

Zimmerman was treated Feb. 27 at Altamonte Family Practice. A phone call made Tuesday evening to the practice rang unanswered.

Some of the injuries were previously reported by The Associated Press based on video of Zimmerman at a jail sally port.


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 1:20 am 
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This is interesting. My main hope now is that all of the evidence will come out, all the facts that will show what exactly happened on that night, both evidence that potentially implicates Zimmerman as well as evidence that could potentially exhonorate him. Let the facts fall where they may.

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